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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My 2001 9-5 automatic with B205E engine and Positive Crankcase Ventilation kit fitted emits a large cloud of smoke at start-up only - does not continue after a few seconds. Any ideas?
 

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Valve stems seals? That is the other possibility. The dont go often but

I've done one set in 10 years. Done at least 10 turbos this year so far.

What's the mileage on this car?

The one that got valve stem seals from me was at 285k, now at 320k+. I feel safe calling it a turbo. A way to be sure is to remove the downpipe and look for burned oil oil tracing out of the turbo, but I guess valve stems could do that too.

Turbo's will smoke on start for a while, then clear up. My mom's wagon did this from the 60k mark until a total failure at 85k.
 

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A fair point on the stem seals. They're definitely a possibility, depending on mileage as Nick said.

The biggest red flag is that the OP has the glorious 99-02 9-5, where turbos shit the bed frequently before the sludging issues were worked out.

ggcd70, did you hav your oil pan dropped and checked before you bought the car?
 

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My 2000 9-5 with 116,000 miles does the exact same.

Told by the mechanic at my work to try a thicker oil but that just made it worse.

Ive had the intake off and checked the turbo and all seams fine also my turbo looks to be replace by the previous owner( can post pics if you like)

The only thing i havent checked is from the down pipe to see about oil there.

At the moment im just running it.

Edit: Also some where along the lines it had the PCV update kit but im unsure if the sump was dropped.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Many thanks people (all but one from far side of Atlantic Ocean! - my first car was a 1958 Plymouth wagon when I spent 2 years in Ohio long ago - no turbos then nor computers in cars but I put in electronic ignition when transistors were hardly known about, all valves in stereo amplifiers etc.) for your thoughtful suggestions - much appreciated. I have been busy buying another Saab 9-5 automatic saloon (2008 1.9 diesel 37000 miles - my first diesel) but would like to get the old one repaired for daughter to take over.
To Mike in Boston, first thing I did to this car when I got it at 58000 miles was drop the sump and found all perfectly clean as previous owner had changed oil very frequently. And then put on PCV modification kit.
Nick, the mileage now is 93000 miles.
I fear it will turn out to be turbo - I know nothing about these (yet). Can't see much of it from above, so guess I must work from underneath to find its intake pipe and downpipe. Will do this in the near future (if it ever stops raining). Many thanks again.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Working from the top will be much better - thanks, Nick. Just have to identify "intake pipe" first, presumably wide diameter - rubber or metal? I have a Haynes book (don't know if this is familiar to you in the USA) but it doesn't help much with this problem. Any other sources of info to consult? It's midnight here now, so "time for bed". Look forward to any further elementary advice!
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Finding oil coating the inside of the wide diameter rubber tube attached to the top of the throttle housing convinces me that the turbo is faulty. I would like to check the shaft for sideways play, but it seems that I must remove the turbo to do this. (It's the 2.0 LP B205E engine, don't know if this was sold in USA.)
In bright sunshine for good visibility and with the heat shield removed, I can identify most of the parts illustrated (fuzzy grey photos) in my Haynes manual and think I should be able to take out the turbo and have it "remanufactured" with new seals etc. Have checked that the 4 nuts securing it to the exhaust manifold flange will come off ok. Hope for <£200 (<$300) total!
 

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The flange bolts are notorious for rusting shut. It might be easier to take out the whole manifold with the turbo attached.

The three downpipe flange bolts are easier to remove (and easier to cut if necessary).
 

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Finding oil coating the inside of the wide diameter rubber tube attached to the top of the throttle housing convinces me that the turbo is faulty. I would like to check the shaft for sideways play, but it seems that I must remove the turbo to do this. (It's the 2.0 LP B205E engine, don't know if this was sold in USA.)
In bright sunshine for good visibility and with the heat shield removed, I can identify most of the parts illustrated (fuzzy grey photos) in my Haynes manual and think I should be able to take out the turbo and have it "remanufactured" with new seals etc. Have checked that the 4 nuts securing it to the exhaust manifold flange will come off ok. Hope for <£200 (<$300) total!
Don't need to remove the turbo, just pull the cobra pipe off ( its easy to find looks like a cobra attached to the front of the turbo. Remove it and stick you fingers in there to move the compressor wheel

BTW mine started smoking at 80K miles and ran like that for another 60K miles, so my question is whay bother ( when they really go it will look like james' bonds car....and not really cause and issues
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
The flange bolts are notorious for rusting shut. It might be easier to take out the whole manifold with the turbo attached.

The three downpipe flange bolts are easier to remove (and easier to cut if necessary).
Thanks Mike - Guessing that the rusty-looking nuts might be a problem after 11 years of heating to near red-hot, I did check that these 4 nuts securing the turbo to the exhaust manifold flange do unscrew easily, thank goodness. Gives me confidence that rest will be relatively easy (but it's raining again, supposed to be mid-summer). Driving my "new" 2008 diesel 9-5 now...
 

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The flange bolts are notorious for rusting shut. It might be easier to take out the whole manifold with the turbo attached.

The three downpipe flange bolts are easier to remove (and easier to cut if necessary).
Honestly, I'd MUCH rather snap studs in the turbo I'm throwing away than breaking the head/manifold studs. snapping a manifold stud means you're pulling the head to have them drilled/tapped/helicoiled.

When you do this, It's better to deal with the tight space than deal with broken parts.
 

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Honestly, I'd MUCH rather snap studs in the turbo I'm throwing away than breaking the head/manifold studs. snapping a manifold stud means you're pulling the head to have them drilled/tapped/helicoiled.

When you do this, It's better to deal with the tight space than deal with broken parts.
That's a fair point.

I've taken off the turbo this way multiple times in 3 different Saabs and I never had an issue, but I know it can happen. The only issues I've had are from the nuts seizing on the studs and needing to back out the entire stud and crack the nut off in a vise. I've wrecked more than a couple of studs that way and had to replace them.

If the OP's flange nuts are turning, then he's golden.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
With courage, I found it easy to take off all the required tubes etc and remove the intake "cobra" pipe. To my surprise, there was zero play in the shaft and the fan rotated with perfect freedom, gliding around frictionlessly and with zero play. There were a few drops of clean oil in the bottom of the chamber under the fan blades, and the banjo joint was very oily when I disconnected it from the top of the "cobra" pipe, so I wonder if this is coming from the crankcase ventilation system. I did replace the 1-inch outside diameter hose from the rocker cover to the oil trap with a new one (correct part) a month ago as the old one was soggy with a hole in it - the latest PCV replacement kit was installed 2008 and along with 6000 mile oil changes has been fine. The one-way check valves work properly when I blow through them.
On the radiator side of the turbo, there is some kind of device with a lever actuated by a rod running horizontally out of a cylinder - I was able to pull this out over half an inch against strong spring pressure to check it was not seized.
All back together again easily, will have to wait till morning to see amount of blue smoke - my new 2008 diesel produces none at all. Perhaps I am too fussy about smoke on start-up from a 93,000 mile 2001 2.0 litre LP ?
 

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no... you shouldn't have any blue smoke.

If you think the pcv is allowing too much smoke, pull off the intake pipe going to the throttle-body. see if the inside is covered in oil.

It usually takes a while before oil will be drawn up through the IC and make it's way into the engine, though.
Although I've never seen it happen on a saab, there's a chance the "bad valve seals" guesses were right.
 
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