Could be a head gasket. And if it's been run too much like that, it could make the motor have some bad sounds. My friend bought a 900 with a bad HG that killed the motor. Sounded about like yours does before we pulled the motor out and put a new one in...

I think you need a new motor...that's a loud knock.

 

That crossed my mind, wouldn't that show some pretty noticeable loss in compression in at least one cylinder though?

Would there be a pretty distinct sign on one or more of the sparkplug(s)?

 

Turbo would create oily smoke, not that white smoke. Check your oil and see what it looks like. That will maybe tell.

 

That's not good at all. That sounds like pistons hitting the gear or something. You can see it has a bad skip in the puffing the exhaust is doing when it ticks. Im sure that engine is junk.

 

This is where direct ignition engines SUCK, cant even pull a plug wire to check each cylinder........ Like everyone else has said that is definitely NOT oil, that is coolant and lots of it. Have you checked your compression yet? Good thing to try is to pull the DI cassette off and take out the spark plugs, have someone crank it over while you watch what comes out of what cylinder, bet you will have one shooting water. That motor is junk too, that knocking you hear is prolly a rod bearing going south or even a bent rod due to hydro-lock from all the coolant. Rest of the car looks clean though Now I want to tear this engine down myself to look at the carnage Always loved when things went wrong and I could tear it apart to see why haha.

 

That's what is confusing me. I checked the compression and it's 170-180 in every cylinder. A picture of the oil below, it doesn't seem to show any blatant sign of water in it, though it is sort of brownish...i want to get a good look at it under the sunlight tomorrow.

Coolant looks fairly normal and there is still plenty in the container, though I haven't run the car for any extended period of time

Plugs are all fairly good, some minor signs of carbon buildup.

The engine and all it's exterior components appear to be in very good condition, clean.

My dad was reading the compression gauge while I cranked it. I'm sure he would have said something if water was squirting out any of the cylinders.

Is it possible a seal let go int he turbo and released coolant into the exhaust? is it then possible some part of the turbo and making that noise?

I guess the next step might as well be to take the turbo out for inspection, if that seems in good order then like you said- time to open up the engine and have a look

 

Oil pressure idiot light? There are no coolant seals in that turbo. That blowby shouldn't be coming out of the dipstick tube like that.

B205's sludge up because of a few things. Saab went with lower friction rings creating more blowby. The PCV system couldn't handle the extra blowby and the oil would become contaminated. Saab came up with PCV upgrades up to version #6. The oil pickup screen would become clogged and oil starvation would cause bearing failures. Saab recommended oil changes at 10K and that's pretty much what caused the death of most B205's. Saab did make good on the engine failures up to 8 years back, unlimited miles.

I bought the same kind of car you did for $500. Same issues, without the blown turbo seal smoke and/or HG issues. The crank was bad. Good luck finding a good B205. They're kinda scarce and pricey unless you get lucky like I did. Bought an Ebay wreck and did not dismantle it. I used the body and other parts from the car that needed an engine to fix the Ebay wreck. Sold a lot of parts, enough to pay for the Ebay car, the original car, and then some. The wreck was an easy fix (fenders were OK, but everything back to the exhaust manifold was crushed including the hood) and only had 52K on it.
Made enough selling parts to pay for both cars and then some. Then got $325 at the salvage yard!

There are two versions of the B205 and they are identical. The 9-3 SE is a High Output Turbo (HOT) version of your engine, but only because of the full crossflow intercooler, the Td04 turbo, and the ECU tune to take advantage of those two items. You have a few options. Have fun & good luck!

 

Thanks for the reply's everyone.

Do you think this engine could be rebuilt? I'm guessing I would have to get it torn down and check for cracks in the engine block ya?

If worst comes to worst, what engines will fit in this car? isn't it like 94-2002 all four cylinders but anything bigger then base 2.0 requires computer tinkering which can only be done by someone with saab software? Six cylinder won't fit?

 

Thanks for the reply's everyone.

Do you think this engine could be rebuilt? I'm guessing I would have to get it torn down and check for cracks in the engine block ya?

If oil starved, you could have several premature wear related issues. Check everything. No to the V6, that's a 9-5 engine. Too much trouble for nothing in return.
I'd put the B205 (T7)head on the B204 (T5) block, and keep the T5 cams for future use. The B204 has tougher pistons, if you're thinking about modding your car. Saab went from Trionoc 5 to Trionic 7 in 2000, except the Viggen went T7 in 1999.
Anyone with more info want to jump in here?
Looks like BaldSaab put a T5 engine in a T7 car.

 

I think you can only use the 2.0 from 2000-2002 since older cars have the T5 engine management and yours has T7.

 

i got my motor out of a 1997

 

I always thought the wiring harness was different between T5 and T7, and that the ECU was as well. When we put a motor in my friends '98 I was told only to get a T5 (B204) motor form '94-'98.

Baldsaab, did you have to rewire it?

 

Got a good look at the oil and coolant. there is no evidence of water/oil separation in ether.

If there is any water in the oil or any oil in the water it is perfectly mixed together in ether/or.

From what I understand if there is ether/or it should be clearly visible and separated when looked at through a clear container?

So this is perplexing to me. No oil in water, not water in oil. Compression is 170-180 in all 4 cylinders. Sparkplugs all look normal.

Yet I have billows of white smoke pouring out of the exhaust and some loud racket coming from the engine bay.

I'm headed up to get a repair manual in a a hour or so for a guide on taking the turbo out, and later taking the engine out if need be.

 

its the engine; the turbo does not make a knocking sound. To be sure take the intake and down pipe off the turbo and check the shafts for play. And just for more clarification you can use the t5 motor; just swap everything over to that black. Another option too is getting the b234 engine. That engine will handle 400+ hp and all you would need is the ecu tuned for the extra displacement

 

its the engine; the turbo does not make a knocking sound. To be sure take the intake and down pipe off the turbo and check the shafts for play. And just for more clarification you can use the t5 motor; just swap everything over to that black. Another option too is getting the b234 engine. That engine will handle 400+ hp and all you would need is the ecu tuned for the extra displacement

In bold, you mean putting my head on a B234(with all the B234 accessories), and bolting it up to my current tranny?

 

I almostttttt have the turbo out.

There is two studs that did not come out attaching the turbo tot he manifold. these two studs prevent me from moving it side to side.

The intake pipe just sets on the ac condenser so I can't move the turbo down at all.

I figured the intake pipe would just pop off after i loosened the torq bolt...but it doesn't seem to want to pop off....

Any tricks here anyone knows of?

Also... i felt in the exhaust side of the turbo and checked for play. it's literally just floating around in there and can be moved all around. It doesn't even feel like the bearing are intact any more at all.

There is no possible way that could be making that noise in the video?

 

No turbos do not knock, they just squeal and whine. The knock you hear is most likely a rod going. BTW what does the exhaust SMELL like? Oil is very easy to tell from coolant......... Does sound like you need a new turbo though. Whats your oil level at?

 

sounds like rod knock. and it looks like someone put too much seafoam in the car

 

The engine is fubar, its not the turbo making that awful racket. That's a rhythmic noise coming from the engine internals. Sounds like nasty rod knock to me. Regardless of what it is, its metal on metal, and it sounds like time for a motor swap.

 

Ok so after watching that video you ARE burning oil, there is no doubt about that if the turbo wheels wobble that much the bearing and seals arent going to contain the oil, bet your intercooler is filled with oil too. Take off an intake piece and look inside, the engine has ingested some metal too by the look of the compressor blades. Just swap out the whole engine, much easier that way. I wouldnt bother with that unless you want to make a nice project out of it. Bet it was a little low on boost

 

I think he meant just a swap, not your head onto a newer block. Would be easier, plus don't have to speculate on the valvetrain being dinged up.

 

Thanks.

If I'm reading correct that would be an engine specifically out of a 1990 - 1998 saab 9000.

Any idea how "plug & play" this swap would be? A lot of modifications to make it work? I'm guessing it uses my stock automatic transmission.

 

I wonder if it is possible to inspect the connecting rods for malfunction from below with the engine in :shock:

 

Got the oil pan off. doesn't look to good.

metal chunks on the oil pan in one picture. those chunks on my finger in another. and a shot of the crankshaft.

 

I looked into this a little further and I think a lot of what I found in the oil pan was actually clumps of carbon.

However, after taking off the end-caps to the connecting rods and inspecting the lower races I found that 3 looked pretty decent as seen in a picture below, but one had the silver layer peeling away and clearly more worn then the other 3.

Could this bad race be whats causing the knock? What are the chances I replace all the rod bearings with the engine in the vehicle, get a new/used turbo and putting it back together and trying it out?

I was thinking getting two oil filters and a bunch of oil, and a new oil pan gasket(it doesn't appear to have one now :/ ). cycling the new oil by hand at first. Then turning the engine over without the direct ignition connected for awhile. Then starting the car and idling it for 10-20 minutes. Drain/drop the oil pan clean it all out thoroughly again, replace the oil filter, fill it back up with new oil, hand crank, crank with no direct ignition, then firing it up and idling it again.

 

Was the bearing for the first picture good too? Or is that the bearing for it in pic #2? Try seeing if you can move the connecting rods up and down in the pistons while they are still in there, your knock might be at the wrist pin end. How do the journals on the crank look? Are they scored any? I have seen the lead/tin plug up an oil galley hole once on a Caterpillar 3516 before, was knocking like hell too. Also take a look (if you can) at the bottom of the cylinders for any scoring from piston slap, since you have the pan off check everything you can Since you have one bad bearing change them all, not worth chancing it with the others. Plus they should be cheap, not like they are precious metals or anything.

 

Was the bearing for the first picture good too? Or is that the bearing for it in pic #2?

First picture is a separate bearing still in the end cap (or whatever it's called), two other bearings look the same way.

picture 2 is of cylinder #2 and is the only one that to my eye seemed pretty worn (as you can see in the picture)

Try seeing if you can move the connecting rods up and down in the pistons while they are still in there, your knock might be at the wrist pin end.

damn....I wish I had thought of that when i individually took them all out to inspect them...lollllll good idea

How do the journals on the crank look? Are they scored any?

not that i noticed, but I would like to have a closer look with a flashlight on #2 since I spotted that bad/worn bearing.

 

no noticeable play in the upper connecting rod/piston. of course if i pushed/pulled hard enough the piston just slid up/down in the cylinder.

didn't see any scaring, but a slight buildup of something right at the bottom line of where the piston stops in the cylinder and starts returning to the top:

 

Wow that is a nasty looking oil LOL. What does the something feel like? Looks almost like metal from the pic alone........that wouldnt be good. Does anyone know if Saab used torque-to-yield bolts in the bottom end? Can you post pics of all the bearing surfaces? I want to see what I can see in the bearing material if anything, if they are all back in the engine you dont have to then LOL. Bah wish I was there, this is interesting now, I love a mystery............when its not MY mystery to deal with and spend money on

So since its morning here (2:20am) and I have to go do my papers will be back to look at the pics again, I have my Failure Analysis book here from when I was at Caterpillar so I will look through the pages again on engine bearings.

 

Wow that is a nasty looking oil LOL. What does the something feel like? Looks almost like metal from the pic alone........that wouldnt be good. Does anyone know if Saab used torque-to-yield bolts in the bottom end? Can you post pics of all the bearing surfaces? I want to see what I can see in the bearing material if anything, if they are all back in the engine you dont have to then LOL. Bah wish I was there, this is interesting now, I love a mystery............when its not MY mystery to deal with and spend money on

So since its morning here (2:20am) and I have to go do my papers will be back to look at the pics again, I have my Failure Analysis book here from when I was at Caterpillar so I will look through the pages again on engine bearings.

I can get a picture of all the bearings, when I do that I work on getting that stuff out of the cylinder and see what it is.

I'm curious if that bad bearing I took the picture of is enough to create that knock int he first video. Seems like it could be where it's so bad chunks of metal are peeling off.

My first though was that it's only what is probably thousandths of an inch how could it create so much knock...but I guess if you factor in 7-900 RPMs it makes some sense if that bearing is whats causing the knock.

Also...I know everyone seems to agree the turbo wasn't doing it...but that thing had to have been making some noise the way it bouncing around in there, and all I heard was the knock. it was so loose in there the impeller/turbine has chunks missing from it from bouncing off the housing.

 

Well it is 7-900 RPM with thousands of PSI of pressure too when the power stroke happens. This is what a turbo sounds like when it starts to eat the housing for lunch

there is also this but not sure if all that is just the turbo

. Cant wait for the pics

 

Almost done, got two left to go. I made a little swab to get up in the cylinder and get that stuff out, it was like dust because I couldn't even distinguish it on the swab when i pulled it out.

Should be done soon. I did notice that their was a ton of little (what i think was) carbon chunks all in and around the bottom of the pan and coated up in the oil pickup screen. I could squeeze then between my fingers and break them up. I thought they were metal at first

 

Should be done soon. I did notice that their was a ton of little (what i think was) carbon chunks all in and around the bottom of the pan and coated up in the oil pickup screen. I could squeeze then between my fingers and break them up. I thought they were metal at first [/QUOTE]

sludge

 

sludge

Thanks I was wondering if that's what everyone was referring to by "sludge".

 

I ran a cloth around where the rod bearings rests on the crankshaft(i forget what it's called lol) to get the metal shavings from the bearings out.

From what I can tell there doesn't appear to be any damage to the crank. I took a picture of those crank area's but it didn't come out to great.

Only thing left I can think to do is check the crankshaft for "play" while I'm at it. is that possible to do without taking the caps off/pulling the engine? Should I be able to feel it if i just try and move it around by hand like I did the rods?

Then after I'm done and I get all the new bearings in and turbo back on I'm thinking I should pull the valve cover off and inspect the top end for and metal/sludge/carbon buildup?

 

Ok here is what I can see just from the pictures...
1. You have severe foreign particle damage to all the bearings shown. AKA dirt & debris.
2.There has/is a lack of adequate oil flow, flow equals pressure so if you aren't flowing enough oil (like a plugged pickup screen or severely failed bearing letting most oil flow out) you wont have enough pressure to keep the crankshaft floating in the middle of the bearing and it will contact the surface and smear the bearing material.

This isnt as good as my book but here is a decent online version of what I have, just mine is Cat. http://www.engineparts.com/publications/CL77-3-402.pdf I would replace all your bearings, they have all had debris go through them and some of it is still embedded in the soft bearing surface. The crank looks salvageable in the picture but the wear right in the middle is worrying me a little, looks like debris may have scored the case hardened steel of the journal....... If you are willing you can take off one of the main caps at a time for the crank and use some plastigauge to check the bearings for wear there. I dont know if Saab used torque to yield bolts on the bottom end though, if they did you will need all new bolts if you remove them. Try cutting open your oil filter carefully (edges will be sharp) and look inside the filter pleats for debris or metal, if you get the pleats out fold it flat (should want to fold flat anyways once cut down one side) and squeeze it between a vice to get the oil out, then look for crap inside the material.