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Performance Modifications for the NG900 / Old 9-3 This forum contains PERFORMANCE related Q&A's for the NG900 and 9-3. This may also include suspension.

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Old 07-20-2013, 07:03 PM   #1
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Saab Viggen build questions

So, I am at the point where I am unsatisfied with the b234/5 I have in my viggen currently.

I am planning on building another motor but am unsure what route to go.
I would prefer to use the b234 due to connecting rod strength and just upgrade pistons. I am working on an intake manifold to be able to use a t5 cylinder head still, with the correct injector angle and to keep the t7 throttle body, fastener locations, ETC.
I have heard rumors of blown stock b234/204 headgaskets. (Kevin Yankton's ng900 has had 2 headgaskets on it since its new owner with arp head studs, and yes I know the owner personally, wicked car!) ANYWAYS.
My question is, is it possible to implement a b235 multi layer headgasket on a b234 block/head. I would of course have both the head resurfaced and the block decked. But I am unsure if the valve clearance is enough to be able to implement it, the gaskets crushed seem at least 1-2mm different in thickness. I do not want to go the route of swapping all the t5 components into a t7 head, I believe yllwjet did this (correct me if I am wrong please). I am just curious. Also thoughts on ARP head studs. Stock headbolts clamping force adequate? Or are ARP's needed for higher boost applications. I am planning on upwards of 25psi but no more than 32 for the calculated compression ratio with the turbocharger I have been looking into, for a 400whp goal.

Of course either way the rotating assembly will be balanced, too. Weight matched rods, etc ETC!

Picture of the motor currently in the car!


And the car itself....
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Old 09-20-2013, 03:56 PM   #2
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I'm sure you have had lots of input on this particular build.

I'm just curious as to why you would go with a T5 head? The T7 head as you know flows more CFM than the T5. Upgrading the camshafts, and then getting a 3 angle valve-job, along with using Trollspeed Valve Springs would give you the flow, and strength you would need for high-rpm needs without valve-float.

Then, the pistons: Granted the 234 block is able to withstand applications of up to 400whp without breaking into the internals, but really the t7 block is tough stuff as well. If you really were on a budget, i could see your point using the 234 bottom end, but with all you just said you were going to do, dialing in the motor and getting everything to fit seems like an insane amount of work. Just getting it together would be one thing...but then making adjustments after the first ten minutes of running and throwing multiple CEL's would just be a pain to get everything working....not that it couldn't be done of course...you'd just be chasing ghosts for a while...

Anyway, If you really are balancing everything at a machine shop...have then put in the pauter 235 rods from GS, or go crazy and but the verdi rods from overseas, wossener 91mm pistons, and then lightened flywheel, and you will EASILY reach 450whp. you'd start breaking clutches and gearboxes before you put your engine in danger.

Hope you get what you need!
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Old 09-20-2013, 03:59 PM   #3
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Just re-read your post and realized you already have a hybrid...sorry. The gasket matching can be done, but you probably need to drill a dowel-pin locator hole as it is in a different location if you use a t7 gasket. I talked to a guy who did the t7 head on his 9k. That and matching the valve cover for oil pump was his biggest problem.
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Old 09-21-2013, 06:00 AM   #4
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What do you have in there now exactly? What isn't satisfying to you? If your goal is 400whp you don't need to go nearly that far on a build, a stock B235R with a set of forged pistons and T5 cams will easily do 400whp. Just balance it and go; some people don't even do a balance. A stock T5 engine will also do 400whp.

What turbo are you thinking and what's your RPM target? If you have a medium frame turbo and good tuning you can get to get 400 with waaay less than 32psi. Stock T7 head/springs etc. are good to more than 6000rpm.

A T5 headgasket will fit on a T7 car. I ran a B235R with a T5 gasket for awhile; don't know about doing the opposite. Either way, stock head bolts and either sock headgasket will handle 400whp.
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First T7 19T turbo setup. First T7 Deka 80lb. injector setup.

Last edited by Drew in Houston; 09-21-2013 at 06:06 AM.
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Old 09-22-2013, 03:53 PM   #5
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew in Houston View Post
What do you have in there now exactly? What isn't satisfying to you? If your goal is 400whp you don't need to go nearly that far on a build, a stock B235R with a set of forged pistons and T5 cams will easily do 400whp. Just balance it and go; some people don't even do a balance. A stock T5 engine will also do 400whp.

What turbo are you thinking and what's your RPM target? If you have a medium frame turbo and good tuning you can get to get 400 with waaay less than 32psi. Stock T7 head/springs etc. are good to more than 6000rpm.

A T5 headgasket will fit on a T7 car. I ran a B235R with a T5 gasket for awhile; don't know about doing the opposite. Either way, stock head bolts and either sock headgasket will handle 400whp.

All of this.

The T5 rods aren't stronger than the T7 ones. It's just the T7 pistons are more likely to fracture at the top ring land and catch inside the cylinder, bending or snapping the rod. Swapping in forged pistons is the way to go, and the deficiencies of the T7 fuel pump can be negated with frequent oil changes.
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