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Performance Modifications for the NG900 / Old 9-3 This forum contains PERFORMANCE related Q&A's for the NG900 and 9-3. This may also include suspension.

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Old 09-13-2009, 06:30 PM   #1
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18T necessary steps?

Im thinking of upgrading my Viggen turbo to an 18T in the next few months and was just trying to think of what I'd need. Would forged pistons be needed? Also would different injectors need to be put in?
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Old 09-13-2009, 06:34 PM   #2
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You have to give more information on the car. If it is t5 aka a ng900 or a 1999 og9-3 then you don't need forged pistons. If it is a 2000 or newer og9-3 or any year Viggen, you will need pistons to safely run at this power level.

Regardless of the car, you will need larger injectors and a new tune. This is assuming you have all the hardware to support this for instance larger intercooler, 3" exhaust, uprated clutch (if manual) etc.
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Old 09-13-2009, 06:40 PM   #3
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His car has:
- GS Rear Sway Bar 22mm

- GS Polyutherane Transmission Mount

- GS Polyutherane Engine Mount

- GS SaabSport Exhaust 2.5"

- GS Cobra Intake Pipe

- Jak Stoll 3" Downpipe

- Replaced Silicon Vacuum lines

- GS Open Air Filter

- ECU flash

- MP Performance Intercooler

- MP Performance Diverter Valve

- 3.5" Fuel Pressure Regulator

- T5 Camshafts

- GS Hatch Brace



oh boy, keep me updated
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Old 09-13-2009, 06:44 PM   #4
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If it is a 2000 or newer og9-3 or any year Viggen, you will need pistons to safely run at this power level.
Not true at all. In fact, many times running forged pistons in a daily driver isn't really such a great idea.

You'll want to add larger injectors, and probably eventually a fuel pump to match.

edit: If you go the 18T route make sure that you clip the turbine side.
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First T7 19T turbo setup. First T7 Deka 80lb. injector setup.

Last edited by Drew in Houston; 09-13-2009 at 06:57 PM.
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Old 09-13-2009, 07:06 PM   #5
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Not true at all. In fact, many times running forged pistons in a daily driver isn't really such a great idea.

You'll want to add larger injectors, and probably eventually a fuel pump to match.

edit: If you go the 18T route make sure that you clip the turbine side.
I have heard the forged pistons don't last as long but i don't know how much truth is behind it.
I have a walbro 255 fuel pump laying around so I'll need injectors/tune and the turbo upgrade and be safe to run it? Any more input on the need of forged pistons?

P.S- Rafal i love the car man, its faster than my last one for sure! I just want to make it a bit faster now
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Old 09-13-2009, 07:17 PM   #6
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so you have Rafal's LB vig huh?
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Old 09-13-2009, 07:24 PM   #7
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so you have Rafal's LB vig huh?
Yes sir. Its in much better shape than my last Viggen for sure!
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Old 09-13-2009, 08:06 PM   #8
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I didn't know if it is a DD or not, just relaying what I know about the pistons in these cars.
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Old 09-13-2009, 08:22 PM   #9
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you also would be much better off with a 6cm exhaust side



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Old 09-13-2009, 08:28 PM   #10
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You need the 6cm to make this right (7 from a volvo if you have welding skills), seimens 60 lb injectors, a tune and you are good to go. Just tell the tuner that you want a safe tune, don't make it hit all at once low in the rpm range and away you go. You do not need forged pistons, but if you have the money, go fot it and get a bigger turbo.
Everyone use to hate on the 19t, but it seems like a few have them now without an issue so that is an optin as well.
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Old 09-13-2009, 08:30 PM   #11
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yeah 6cm exhaust houseing. you should be able to get away with the 5cm and standard pistons as long as you are not beating/tracking the car. injectors and tune ditto.
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Old 09-13-2009, 08:44 PM   #12
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might t5 cams help lower egts and preserve pistons?
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Old 09-13-2009, 10:01 PM   #13
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Drew, can you go a bit deeper into the specifics of why your car can run at 300whp/300wtq on stock T7 while others "can't" (shouldn't)

not to challenge you, I am in the same boat at the original poster, and want to go 18/19T on T7 but the piston thing is something I am having a hard time finding info on. The "Proof" section has some great info but not exactly what I am looking for. I feel this is relevant to the thread-if not, carry on...

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Old 09-14-2009, 12:27 AM   #14
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Drew, can you go a bit deeper into the specifics of why your car can run at 300whp/300wtq on stock T7 while others "can't" (shouldn't)

not to challenge you, I am in the same boat at the original poster, and want to go 18/19T on T7 but the piston thing is something I am having a hard time finding info on. The "Proof" section has some great info but not exactly what I am looking for. I feel this is relevant to the thread-if not, carry on...

Joel
Oh you can challenge me, no problem. There's a bunch I don't know. So I can only speak for my car, but I haven't seen any issues with running 300+ HP. I think there's a lot of bad tuning around. IMO it's likely that massive torque spikes break pistons faster than smooth high power. From what I've seen there is absolutely no problem at all running 300WHP on stock pistons if you don't "tune" for a torque spike. I'm about to try running closer to 350.

Forged pistons are cool for sure, they just don't fit with the amount of miles that I put on my car. They're made from material that's harder than the cylinder walls and they will wallow out the bore in a short amount of time on a car that sees a lot of miles. I just ordered a set of T5 cams and will put them in with some uprated springs in the next couple of weeks. I'm already running higher boost right now (so it's doing maybe 320(?) at the wheels), so we'll see if/when I break a piston. I don't expect that I will but I could be wrong too. The engine already has 130k miles and has never been apart.

Look at some of the "torque monster" tunes that are around. See the torque spike? The peak breaks stuff and the quick fall on that spike means unhealthy stuff is probably happening mechanically. There are reasons not to do things like strap a spring onto your wastegate and disable your boost control. At the same time, consider that if you can manage to make just 300 ft-lbs. at 7000 rpms that automatically means you're making 400HP.
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First T7 19T turbo setup. First T7 Deka 80lb. injector setup.

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Old 09-14-2009, 04:44 AM   #15
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It seems that 6 cm exhaust housings are very hard to come by, is there anyone/place that sells them?

what kind of number would you expect to the wheels with a 18T/19T setup? Is it 300 like your talking about in your car Drew? Also how do you like it and did you get bored with it quickly or is it enough to keep a smile on your face for a long time?
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Old 09-14-2009, 06:38 AM   #16
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I have the 18T setup in my viggen, and have had it for over 2 years and I was bored after a month. But at that time I was also driving a car that had 3 times the whp as the saab. Now that I don't have that car, I would say that the powr is still fun at times for sure. I have a pretty safe tune, I have no dyno plots, had plenty from before but I moved and I'm not all that into it anymore. I put most my time now in my auto-x car as the season is wrapping up now. I would say based on my butt that the car has around 260-270whp max and I'm sure there is plenty more that could be had if I wanted it too but this is my daily driver and I can't afford a piston cracking.
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Old 09-14-2009, 07:51 AM   #17
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So its possible to put T5 pistons in a T7 motor and have it fit better than forged??? I know people often will put the 234/235 crank and rods in as well, but I was always unsure about the pistons...
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Old 09-14-2009, 10:48 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krelly View Post
It seems that 6 cm exhaust housings are very hard to come by, is there anyone/place that sells them?

what kind of number would you expect to the wheels with a 18T/19T setup? Is it 300 like your talking about in your car Drew? Also how do you like it and did you get bored with it quickly or is it enough to keep a smile on your face for a long time?
See Drew is the lucky one... he has his 300+HP daily driver OG9-3 and then he has the weekend car that is a Single Turbo Rx-7 that is way more fun.
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Old 09-14-2009, 03:21 PM   #19
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I have the 18T setup in my viggen, and have had it for over 2 years and I was bored after a month. But at that time I was also driving a car that had 3 times the whp as the saab. Now that I don't have that car, I would say that the powr is still fun at times for sure. I have a pretty safe tune, I have no dyno plots, had plenty from before but I moved and I'm not all that into it anymore. I put most my time now in my auto-x car as the season is wrapping up now. I would say based on my butt that the car has around 260-270whp max and I'm sure there is plenty more that could be had if I wanted it too but this is my daily driver and I can't afford a piston cracking.
Thanks for the input. I'd probably opt for a conservative tune since this is my DD as well. would torque be in the same neighborhood as the 260-270 whp?
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Old 09-14-2009, 04:40 PM   #20
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Thanks for the input. I'd probably opt for a conservative tune since this is my DD as well. would torque be in the same neighborhood as the 260-270 whp?
It will be more, my stage 3+ was 305, but this will depend on what you want as a tuner can set it up so you get a massive torque/hp spike which some like. Personally, I wanted a car that pulled well and did not hit hard.
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