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Performance Modifications for the NG900 / Old 9-3 This forum contains PERFORMANCE related Q&A's for the NG900 and 9-3. This may also include suspension.

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Old 06-25-2008, 01:34 PM   #1
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Thumbs down Air/Fuel gauage problems

so i installed a Air/Fuel guage in my vert and powered it with the same power i use for the boost guage and no the only light i get is full rich. last night it was reading good went into wal mart and now all i get is the full rich light on

help please
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Old 06-25-2008, 01:37 PM   #2
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Is it a wideband? If you are piggybacking off a stock sensor its only narrow band. There for only showing correct readings at full throttle.
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Old 06-25-2008, 01:43 PM   #3
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No its not wideband yes i used my non being used rear o2 sensor
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Old 06-25-2008, 01:44 PM   #4
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Maybe you tapped the wrong signal wire?
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Old 06-25-2008, 01:44 PM   #5
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the rear o2 sensor is post cat,, so id think it will give you a pretty bad reading.. the cat filters fumes quite a bit
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Old 06-25-2008, 01:47 PM   #6
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True, we used the front O2 sensor when my brother put in an gauge as well.
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Old 06-25-2008, 01:50 PM   #7
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i don't have a cat
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Old 06-25-2008, 02:40 PM   #8
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Does it just stay there, even on startup? When the sensor warms it will usually climb up the red int the yellow until the sensor starts reading.

Sounds like you don't have signal, not that a narrowband will do anything useful anyways, but it's a fun light show

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Old 06-25-2008, 04:08 PM   #9
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If you have not spliced it right and if it is not grounded well you can run into all sorts of problems. My advice, dump it if its not a wideband as those things are pretty much junk! And I can admit that I had one in my old spg, and it was only good for adjusting a\f at idle.
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Old 06-25-2008, 06:52 PM   #10
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Eleborating a little on what everyone else said already. Narrowband is 100% useless when you're tuning for performance because the sensor is blind above and below 14.7:1 AFR. Think of it as a switch. Your engine controller uses the information to trim the fuel injection. Under load conditions and especially WOT your fuel control doesn't get any feedback telling the ECU whether the AFR is too lean or too rich...essentially it's blind but it does use that trim information to adjust the amount of fuel that's injected.

You should see it stay pretty steady around idle and at steady-state, no load cruising.

Really, the narrowband open/closed loop setup was a workaround because the wideband sensor technology used to be too expensive but that's not the case anymore. Actually, I think it's safe to assume that all cars in the next few years will come stock with WB O2. There are probably others, but for sure Honda and VW are putting them on the road now.
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Old 06-25-2008, 06:54 PM   #11
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Here's what a narrowband sensor output looks like.



Lambda 1 (14.7:1) on the X axis represents "perfect" combustion by mass, that is, there's just the right amount of fuel present to burn with just the right amount of air. Below Lambda 1 is rich, meaning there's more fuel than air present, and above is lean more air than fuel.

The Y axis is voltage output. See how they haven't even bothered to use the full 0-1000 mV scale and that it's shortened? 1000 mV equals 1 volt. So the sensor output is 0-1 volts, but because of the sensor response, that 0-1 volts is really mostly useful as a switch to tell you if you're above or below 14.7:1 AFR. Maximum HP for an internal combustion spark ignited (SI) gas engine is going to be found around 12.1-12.6:1.
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Last edited by Drew in Houston; 06-25-2008 at 07:04 PM.
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Old 06-30-2008, 08:34 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew in Houston View Post
Here's what a narrowband sensor output looks like.

Lambda 1 (14.7:1) on the X axis represents "perfect" combustion by mass, that is, there's just the right amount of fuel present to burn with just the right amount of air. Below Lambda 1 is rich, meaning there's more fuel than air present, and above is lean more air than fuel.

The Y axis is voltage output. See how they haven't even bothered to use the full 0-1000 mV scale and that it's shortened? 1000 mV equals 1 volt. So the sensor output is 0-1 volts, but because of the sensor response, that 0-1 volts is really mostly useful as a switch to tell you if you're above or below 14.7:1 AFR. Maximum HP for an internal combustion spark ignited (SI) gas engine is going to be found around 12.1-12.6:1.
And its for this reason that most WOT runs with a narrowband will yeild a full rich reading on the gauge. That is normal but it doesnt give any tuning help because it could be 10:1 or 7:1 and would read the same on the gauge face.
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