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Performance Modifications for the NG900 / Old 9-3 This forum contains PERFORMANCE related Q&A's for the NG900 and 9-3. This may also include suspension.

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Old 03-18-2008, 08:48 AM   #1
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My Viggen with Nordic custom tune

Here's another one of the results from the recent Nordic tuning event at Genuine Saab.

The car is a 2000 Viggen. Nick rebuilt the engine with JE forged pistons and also rebuilt the trans with a Quaife limited slip diff.

On this run, the peak horsepower is about 353 at the wheels, peak torque 389 lb-ft. I have some runs with bigger numbers, but this is a pretty one to my eye.

The turbo is a GT2871R/0.64 with Polydyn coating on the exhaust housing, inside and out. I also had the Polydyn coating put on the exhaust manifold, which is the stock cast iron unit opened up a bit by Genuine Saab.

Other related mods include T5 cams and a Walbro fuel pump.

By the way, the car has Nick's three inch downpipe, but the rest of the exhaust is the standard, which I believe is 2 3/8 inch. The stock muffler has been replaced with a Magnaflow unit. So you don't necessarily need a 3 inch system to make big power.

The car feels like stock at low throttle openings, which to me is an indication of a high quality tune. But when I put my foot in it, it is just plain crazy. It's definitely more power than I know how to get to the road.

Many thanks to the Nordic folks and to the folks at Genuine Saab.
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Old 03-18-2008, 08:52 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viggen Dave View Post
Here's another one of the results from the recent Nordic tuning event at Genuine Saab.

The car is a 2000 Viggen. Nick rebuilt the engine with JE forged pistons and also rebuilt the trans with a Quaife limited slip diff.

On this run, the peak horsepower is about 353 at the wheels, peak torque 389 lb-ft. I have some runs with bigger numbers, but this is a pretty one to my eye.

The turbo is a GT2871R/0.64 with Polydyn coating on the exhaust housing, inside and out. I also had the Polydyn coating put on the exhaust manifold, which is the stock cast iron unit opened up a bit by Genuine Saab.

Other related mods include T5 cams and a Walbro fuel pump.

By the way, the car has Nick's three inch downpipe, but the rest of the exhaust is the standard, which I believe is 2 3/8 inch. The stock muffler has been replaced with a Magnaflow unit. So you don't necessarily need a 3 inch system to make big power.

The car feels like stock at low throttle openings, which to me is an indication of a high quality tune. But when I put my foot in it, it is just plain crazy. It's definitely more power than I know how to get to the road.

Many thanks to the Nordic folks and to the folks at Genuine Saab.
Very cool man! I am jealous
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Old 03-18-2008, 08:52 AM   #3
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How much did the custom tune cost you?
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Old 03-18-2008, 08:54 AM   #4
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Thats a very nice curve looks like a blast to drive. Cant wait to get some Engine goodies.
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Old 03-18-2008, 09:09 AM   #5
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Very nice.
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Old 03-18-2008, 09:20 AM   #6
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How much did the custom tune cost you?
I'm not really sure what the cost of the tune alone was. To me, it was just one part of a really big check I wrote for all the parts and all the labor. (I got a nice bonus, and then I spent it!)

Maybe Nick will chime in about the cost and benefits of a custom tune.
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Old 03-18-2008, 09:40 AM   #7
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This looks like an exact copy of my goal for hardware and numbers.

I just can't justify going the Gt30 route. My is goal about 360whp with the GT2871R and T5 cams so seeing your numbers confirms my gut feelings.

If you had it to do all over again, would you go bigger, more power, or change anything?

I reallllly hope I do not get USE to 350+whp and want more. If I do, I don't think it will go into the Viggen as FWD and the chassis will cause me to look elsewhere for more power.
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Old 03-18-2008, 09:50 AM   #8
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That is awesome! It's good to see some viggens with high numbers like that. And is'nt 353 WHP on his dyno less then what a dynojet would post? Can't remember if his is load bearing or not.
Maybe a 3 inch exhaust all the way back would be even better?
Does that turbo fit in the stock location?
Nick, if one when the same route, did you keep the tune so it could be bought from you?
Thanks and great job.
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Old 03-18-2008, 10:03 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by Viggen Dave View Post
By the way, the car has Nick's three inch downpipe, but the rest of the exhaust is the standard, which I believe is 2 3/8 inch. The stock muffler has been replaced with a Magnaflow unit. So you don't necessarily need a 3 inch system to make big power.

I never bought into the 3" exhaust as well...I held out for the Viggen/Remus Sport exhaust which is the 2 3/8" as well which I finally ended up scoring about 2 years ago. I believe Nick proved that the Remus muffler at 2 3/8" was superior to the JT 3"....i.e. less back pressue which is a turbo's worst enemy. Typically the bottle neck in the exhaust from the CAT back is the muffler itself and its ability to flow adiquately and reduce backpressure.
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Last edited by perkj; 03-18-2008 at 10:19 AM.
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Old 03-18-2008, 10:06 AM   #10
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Nice numbers!
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Old 03-18-2008, 10:38 AM   #11
 
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I never bought into the 3" exhaust as well...I held out for the Viggen/Remus Sport exhaust which is the 2 3/8" as well which I finally ended up scoring about 2 years ago. I believe Nick proved that the Remus muffler at 2 3/8" was superior to the JT 3"....i.e. less back pressue which is a turbo's worst enemy. Typically the bottle neck in the exhaust from the CAT back is the muffler itself and its ability to flow adiquately and reduce backpressure.

Have you seen a JT muffler? It's a complete flow-through design with no baffles.


And I believe those tests were done with two different cats, one a racing cat, and one not...

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Old 03-18-2008, 10:41 AM   #12
 
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Dave, those are awesome numbers, man...Congrats!

That much be a hairy handful to drive, but the smile-to-mile ratio is certainly in your favor....

quick q: were those SAE corrected or uncorrected?
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Old 03-18-2008, 10:50 AM   #13
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Have you seen a JT muffler? It's a complete flow-through design with no baffles.


And I believe those tests were done with two different cats, one a racing cat, and one not...
That's what I tought too

I think the point of that test was that the cat used with the JT system sucked. But I don't see any way that a full 3" system with the same cat that Taliaferro downpipe uses would flow worse.
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Old 03-18-2008, 11:45 AM   #14
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That's what I tought too

I think the point of that test was that the cat used with the JT system sucked. But I don't see any way that a full 3" system with the same cat that Taliaferro downpipe uses would flow worse.

That was true for Nick's first test, but not for the 2nd (see Backpressure Pt2 here: http://www.trolltuner.com/archives/2006/02/ ):
So comparing after cat pressures at the same power output it starts to get interesting... With the 3" JT we had 4.4 psi max after the cat. With the Remus 3.2 psi max. This one is 60mm or almost 2-3/8" Both of these are the same configuration. One muffler in the rear. Straight through center pipe and a flex after the downpipe. The sound is so much nicer with the Remus. I still have to find time to test a factory exhaust with and without middle muffler and with and without the downpipe.

I have been double checking all this data just to be sure and get very repeatable results. Not exactly sure why My old cat flowed so poorly with no visible damage to the core. After cat measurements are my main point here. Just trying to compare different size apples... Also as a side note While playing all this exhaust I left the 6point subframe brace off. Thinking I would be going back to all 3", No way. So a few days of driving without the 6pt reminded me how much of a change it actually makes for steering feel and tramlining. Had to put it back on. this sort of power and plain old P6000 "winter" tires just won't play well together. I also posted some more photos in the the http://GenuineSaab.com/Gallery
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Last edited by perkj; 03-18-2008 at 11:48 AM.
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Old 03-18-2008, 11:47 AM   #15
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Nice numbers!
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Old 03-18-2008, 11:50 AM   #16
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Interesting. I would still be very curious to see if 3" on the setup with the power that dave and nick are running would result in more power vs the 2 3/8" remus.

And, I'm certainly no fluid dynamics expert, but I wonder if that pressure test equated exactly to how much each exhaust flows? I mean at some point the 2 3/8 just won't flow enough, what do you do then? Intuition would say go for bigger tubing...
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Old 03-18-2008, 12:03 PM   #17
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Very nice #'s Dave!! Glad to see a hice healthy Viggen there!!
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Old 03-18-2008, 12:04 PM   #18
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That was true for Nick's first test, but not for the 2nd (see Backpressure Pt2 here: http://www.trolltuner.com/archives/2006/02/ ):
[i]So comparing after cat pressures at the same power output it starts to get interesting... With the 3" JT we had 4.4 psi max after the cat. With the Remus 3.2 psi max. This one is 60mm or almost 2-3/8" Both of these are the same configuration. One muffler in the rear. Straight through center pipe and a flex after the downpipe. The sound is so much nicer with the Remus. I still have to find time to test a factory exhaust with and without middle muffler and with and without the downpipe.
As a side note, I could only get my JT 1 muffler up to 2.5PSI when measured after cat (1 muffler). Test was made at rev limiter, with 420bhp output. Airmass flow 320+g/s.

On thing that needs to be remembered is that when you measure "static" pressure the diameter of piece to which you connect the pressure tap must remain the same or results will be screwed.
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Old 03-18-2008, 01:49 PM   #19
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If you had it to do all over again, would you go bigger, more power, or change anything?
I haven't had the car back all that long, but I can't imagine ever needing any more power. The power is quite a handful at this level, so I can't imagine what 400+ horsepower at the wheels would be like.

If I were doing anything different, it might be to buy a MY2001 car, so that I could get traction control.



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Does that turbo fit in the stock location?
Yes, the turbo fits in the stock location.


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quick q: were those SAE corrected or uncorrected?
I believe they are corrected. In the run viewing software, the horsepower and torque columns are labeled with a "C" in front of the units of measurement.
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Old 03-18-2008, 02:06 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Viggen Dave View Post
I haven't had the car back all that long, but I can't imagine ever needing any more power. The power is quite a handful at this level, so I can't imagine what 400+ horsepower at the wheels would be like.

If I were doing anything different, it might be to buy a MY2001 car, so that I could get traction control.





Yes, the turbo fits in the stock location.



I believe they are corrected. In the run viewing software, the horsepower and torque columns are labeled with a "C" in front of the units of measurement.
That is what i wanted to hear.

You are at 401hp at the crank with a 12% loss. Thats a nice round number.

Honestly, I am happy to not have traction control. Its another thing to break and I really only feel a use from it in bad weather where the car is no longer driven anyway.
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