Installed the Sub-Frame Brace - The Saab Link Forums

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Performance Modifications for the NG900 / Old 9-3 This forum contains PERFORMANCE related Q&A's for the NG900 and 9-3. This may also include suspension.

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Old 12-09-2004, 08:17 AM   #1
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Installed the Sub-Frame Brace

I finally got around to installing the sub-frame brace and I was a bit surprised by the results. I had always been skeptical of the improvements that the sub-frame brace could provide so I was quite pleased when I felt the improvement. The brace balances the Saab when pushed under hard turns. Before the brace the Saab understeered rather badly when pushed. Now with the brace it is much more neutral. I can take turns at much greater speed now and with less vagueness coming from the front wheels. Itís quite a good improvement for such a low cost and easy installation. I feel much more confident now in taking on an M3 or Boxter on a twisty road.

Eric
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Old 12-09-2004, 08:31 AM   #2
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yep yep all i need to complete my ish is bigger tires
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Old 12-09-2004, 03:23 PM   #3
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when i had mine on it did help som of the points you said eric but with the car lowerd and the 3in DP it was more of a problem than anything....i talked to someone with the 6pt one and they said that it was the best upgrade they had ever done (nothing much done to the car, viggen)...but yeah the 6pt is a lot of bank and the mp one will do the job for cheaper...
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Old 12-13-2004, 05:29 AM   #4
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iwantaviggen said, "but yeah the 6pt is a lot of bank and the mp one will do the job for cheaper."

I had the MP brace on and the improvement was very slight and may have been mostly placebo. I had the first six point made and installed (Nick now sells them). The differnce was huge! I drive a convertible and have to agree with the guy iwantaviggen spoke to. It is one of the best (if not the best) mod I've done (and I've done about everything I can do!).
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Old 12-13-2004, 05:59 AM   #5
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Hmmm, I do like that 6-point subframe brace...but Ragtop, aren't you the creator of the 6-pointer? Guess there wouldn't be any bias in your thoughts would there.... :P

I avoided trying the traditional subframe brace and have to spacer it to keep from having clearance issues with the larger downpipe. Then having to worry about clearance if I lowered the car. Although its simple and probably effective, hard to beat the price MP has it for.

But if you have a few extra dollars.., I have to admit I like the 6-pointer because it seems to answer the dp clearance issue, and looks like it ties in the whole car; from front to back, and left to right. It was really well-thought out, and just seems to make sense...

Been waiting to put my 6-pointer on to see the difference for myself, just can never seem to find the right time to put it on....so many mods ...and so little time to do them...life.

I'll post pics after I get mine on...

regards
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Old 12-13-2004, 07:31 AM   #6
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DC_SAAB asked:
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Hmmm, I do like that 6-point subframe brace...but Ragtop, aren't you the creator of the 6-pointer? Guess there wouldn't be any bias in your thoughts would there....
No bias whatsoever

I am the co-creator, but if the MP brace had done a sufficient job, I wouldn't have had it built. Your observations of the six point are dead on, it does tie everything together. A single rod tied at two points can't do anything to counteract torsional forces. It can only counteract forces in parallel with the two tie points. The six point was designed to provide triangular bracing to counteract all forces. We also designed it to clear a 3" downpipe with no spacers needed. (I had to add about 1" of spacer to install the MP brace). The 04 CV uses a similar but more massive subframe brace as OE.

You definately need to make the time to install and feel the difference for yourself. I'm sure you'll be impressed.
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Old 12-13-2004, 04:31 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragtop Tiger
iwantaviggen said, "but yeah the 6pt is a lot of bank and the mp one will do the job for cheaper."

I had the MP brace on and the improvement was very slight and may have been mostly placebo. I had the first six point made and installed (Nick now sells them). The differnce was huge! I drive a convertible and have to agree with the guy iwantaviggen spoke to. It is one of the best (if not the best) mod I've done (and I've done about everything I can do!).
well Eric you and MP have a new chalange!!

oh and i cant wait till you guys get that top engine mount done my shifts are still sloppy 1->2 and 3->4
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Old 12-14-2004, 07:36 AM   #8
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Sob story.....

I will quote myself from the SC forum
Quote:
I purchased a MP Performance subframe brace about 6 months ago! Unfortunately I dont have it anymore because it fell off as i was driving!
Be sure to secure any brace with "proper" mounting hardware, i would highly suggest lock nuts!! I can tell you that the brace really works though! I felt the difference in handling when i put it on and a few weeks back i was taking a corner and it didnt seem to grab it like it use too! Nonetheless when i took my car to get the oil cooler lines checked out i had a look at the undercarriage as my car was on the rack! It was gone...no more subframe brace. After looking at it closely it looks like one side came undone probably from the normal vibration then it was probably hanging there for a bit before it came off completely. I came to this conclusion because the metal flange I mounted it too was bent!

For those of you that are installing this brace be sure that you secure it properly or you will lose it! Not only that it poses a danger for the drivers behind you!
Just a heads up cause when i installed mine i made sure i tightened the crap out of it for that very reason! More money down the drain!
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Old 12-14-2004, 09:11 AM   #9
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I saw your post before...., and please don't get me wrong but I often thought in conjecture how one could loose something that large without noticing a noise a thud or bump...

I mean it would have to have come off on both sides perfectly for you not to notice..., unless of course your off-roading your SAAB or something? Seems it would have come off on one side, slide around under your car, then the other side..., and somewhere in-between you would have noticed it sticking out from under your car or hear a strange rattling noise.

I can see the value of your statement and whether anyone else can also validate your experience..., time can only tell. It just seems highly unlikely one would miss it. I know we all beat up occasionally on vendors..(guilty as charged)....but your words mean dollars to the company too. Have you tried seeking help from MP? Cause although I'm sorry to hear that you lost your mod... I also wondered if you considered alternatives for why it may be missing?

Incorrectly installed; someone stole it after hearing you brag about it's performance. :P :P

Just an outside looking in thought... and not intended to offend.

regards
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Old 12-14-2004, 10:41 AM   #10
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Well by no means would i try to put down/ beat up MP and the great job they are doing by supplying us with affordable mods. I just wanted everyone to be aware of what could happen and what did happen to me. As for someone stealing it i think its highly unlikely due to my car being lowered 1.75 inches (good luck getting a jack underneath it) ( i have to drive my car onto 2x4 to lift it), plus its garage kept at night! Someone would have to have the flatest jack in the world plus have worked in a nascar pit crew to take it off quickly before I ran out and knocked them out cold!

Im 99.9% sure it fell off. As i said in my quote this swaybar truly does work! Just be sure to secure correctly and re-tighten occasionally.

I hear thumps and noises when i drive due to daily road conditions and debry but i never thought it would fall off as tightly as i secured it!

Nope, havent contacted MP regarding this, guess i just figured they wouldnt replace it unless it was defective or something! Maybe the mounting hardware was defective or maybe i actually tightened it too much, is this possible over tightening
MP if your listening and would like to send me a new bar out of good faith or pitty, i would gladly accept it

But let me reiterate that this is no attempt to take a shot or beat up on MP Performance, I think they are a great company and am totally all for there affordable products! As a matter of fact when i get some money i will purchase the new MP 3" dp....
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Old 12-14-2004, 12:40 PM   #11
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Send me a pm, I can probably get you another sub-frame brace at cost.

Our new 3Ē downpipes are designed to clear the sub-frame brace with enough room so that clearance will not be an issue. The mounting hardware for the brace comes with nylon crush threads in the nuts to keep them from coming loose.

I donít think anyone doubts that the 6-point brace strengthens the sub-frame better than a single bar design. I just donít want to install it. I am happy with the results I got from the single bar sub-frame brace.

Eric
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Old 12-14-2004, 02:50 PM   #12
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Subframe braces should be looked at by what are you expecting to get from them? Are you looking to get a total race car that runs like its on rails or are you looking for some more sport performance on the freeway onramp? If you look at a Honda or Acura they both have frame braces for sale but not one of them offers a full 6 point frame brace (that I have seen). They always offer a single strut bar for the front or rear and some additional sway bars and maybe a centerlink brace for the rear end and thats it. The 6 point brace is probably a great buy if you are running the twisties in the mountains or SCCA but I am in the same boat that I may just not want to install a full 6point so the single bar design would work well for me and more than likley give me the performance that I was looking for. I think we should keep all things in mind and thats performance comes in all different levels and you have to choose the price for the performance you want and if what you bought is not the level you are looking for then sell it and buy the next one that is more expensive and will meet your expectations.
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Old 12-14-2004, 07:37 PM   #13
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i agree with steve now if we could just get some dyno numbers for the stock auto 9-3 se
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Old 12-14-2004, 08:22 PM   #14
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Hey ricot the dyno numbers are coming. I got bumped by the shop for dyno time so it will be the first week of January before I will even begin to think of getting it on a dyno (That will be after i get it back also with the new body kit on it!!!1).
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