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Performance Modifications for the NG900 / Old 9-3 This forum contains PERFORMANCE related Q&A's for the NG900 and 9-3. This may also include suspension.

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Old 01-15-2008, 03:02 PM   #1
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water/meth install + questions

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...SA:MOTORS:1123
i just got this kit off of ebay.

i had a few questions before installing it, where should i drill the holes in the intake pipe... before or after the temp. sensor? also, those who have water/meth injection what do you use in your mixture?
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Old 01-15-2008, 04:40 PM   #2
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i used to have mine between the bov and the temp sensor somewhere.

and ran 50/50 disilled water and meth.



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Old 01-15-2008, 07:13 PM   #3
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Man $150 thats fantastic friend. What a good deal, I want to do this so bad. As a side note I was talking to John Williams and he asked Jak for me if an off the shelve tune could be done and the answer was yes. Fueling and timing changes need to be made to get the most out of the setup. Good luck!

P.S. it would make sence to me that it should go before the temp sensor, other wise its reading would be off.
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Old 01-15-2008, 07:24 PM   #4
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[QUOTE saabkid37] i used to have mine between the bov and the temp sensor somewhere.[/QUOTE]
where did it go? and what did you use for meth. and where did you get it?


as to what you were saying about the tune cob, im not sure if i want to get a tune for the water/meth... what if i ran out or it failed for what ever reason, there goes the motor. if i was to do that i would want it very mild and it would be in the spring some time when i get new injectors and mayb the 040 fuel pump everyone has been talking about. i just dont know if i should keep the td04 or not. im happy where my power level is now.



anyone here use washer fluild?
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Old 01-15-2008, 07:25 PM   #5
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i used to have mine between the bov and the temp sensor somewhere.
where did it go? and what did you use for meth. and where did you get it?


as to what you were saying about the tune cob, im not sure if i want to get a tune for the water/meth... what if i ran out or it failed for what ever reason, there goes the motor. if i was to do that i would want it very mild and it would be in the spring some time when i get new injectors and mayb the 040 fuel pump everyone has been talking about. i just dont know if i should keep the td04 or not. im happy where my power level is now.



anyone here use washer fluild?
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Old 01-15-2008, 07:45 PM   #6
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where did what go? i used methanol...thats what meth is...i have a race/drag shop that sells it by the gallon nearby...i dont really see how else to get it.

dont use washer fluid...ever notice how your washer nozzles clog up?



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Old 01-15-2008, 09:00 PM   #7
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Smile

I've run Washer fluid for almost a year. I pulled the nozzle off a couple times to check it, and have never had any issues with build-up.

One thing to consider is that the fluid is coming through the nozzle with over 100psi. ~vs. windshield washer nozzles.

Mixing your own methanol with purified water is a better method though not as wallet friendly

Here's some good info on washerfluid http://www.enginerunup.com/shop.php/...luid-/i_1.html

I too argee that you should place the nozzle before the intake temp sensor.

Also try and keep the silenoid as close the the nozzle as possible.

Good Luck,
Mark M
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Old 01-15-2008, 09:25 PM   #8
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Wow, that's a great site!


Placement info:
http://www.enginerunup.com/shop.php/...ement/i_6.html
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Old 01-16-2008, 05:56 PM   #9
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where did what go? i used methanol...thats what meth is...i have a race/drag shop that sells it by the gallon nearby...i dont really see how else to get it.

dont use washer fluid...ever notice how your washer nozzles clog up?
you said you used to have it, did you take it off?
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Old 01-16-2008, 06:00 PM   #10
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oh...yeahi got rid of it long ago...it didnt do enough, really just acted as a poor mans intercooler. which helped the one summer i had it when we had way too many 100 degree days, but once i put on my frontmount on it made no difference.



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Old 01-16-2008, 08:35 PM   #11
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Really!? Were you running a tune for it? I remember seeing someone's results awhile back with an increase of 15whp/35ishwtq..even with the intercooler. That's odd.
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Old 01-16-2008, 10:47 PM   #12
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Yeah It is nice in the summers, traffic, stop-and-go etc.. to reduce negative adaption, but doesnt do much for you otherwise. just keeps you running at a higher efficiency in inconsitant situations.

I do plan to play in the springtime with a MBC and water/meth, to squeeze a few more out of her, for shits+giggles. But first i will dyno, MBC experiment, and re-dyno.

but first; new custom projects are brewin in the suspention department
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Old 01-16-2008, 11:12 PM   #13
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Sounds interesting. Need to take care of a few suspension bits myself..
Yeah, just do different setups on the dyno and post the results. Even if you don't show a gain, your car will probably run a lot healthier with the w/m on.
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Old 01-17-2008, 05:43 AM   #14
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Really!? Were you running a tune for it? I remember seeing someone's results awhile back with an increase of 15whp/35ishwtq..even with the intercooler. That's odd.
no i dont believe in tuning for it because in that one instance you run out of spray because you forget to check the tank or something you are absolute toast.



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Old 01-17-2008, 06:52 AM   #15
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Perhaps...but I'm planning to get some kind of meter for mine and perhaps keep an extra jug in the back. It's anyone's choice, though, I just wondered about the same problem you're mentioning and this is what I'd come up with when I decided I wanted to do this.
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Old 01-17-2008, 01:34 PM   #16
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i just got off the phone with jak, he told me that running w/m with my stage 4 i will see 25psi all day long ( as of now it spikes to 25 and then holds around 21-22). he told me to get a tune for it and really feel the power come alive. but like most of you i do not want to watch a rod in the rear view on the highway if i run out on w/m in my tank. ya, sure you could keep some in the trunk but it will not do you any good if you run out. checking could get to be a pain, some people say everytime you get gas just fill it up but what if it leaked or something happen.

so for my car im planning out a very very safe system and once i get it all set up ill post all the sites and part numbers where i got it all.
and i hope to get the car on a dyno to see what happens.
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Old 01-17-2008, 04:45 PM   #17
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i just got off the phone with jak, he told me that running w/m with my stage 4 i will see 25psi all day long ( as of now it spikes to 25 and then holds around 21-22). he told me to get a tune for it and really feel the power come alive. but like most of you i do not want to watch a rod in the rear view on the highway if i run out on w/m in my tank. ya, sure you could keep some in the trunk but it will not do you any good if you run out. checking could get to be a pain, some people say everytime you get gas just fill it up but what if it leaked or something happen.

so for my car im planning out a very very safe system and once i get it all set up ill post all the sites and part numbers where i got it all.
and i hope to get the car on a dyno to see what happens.
They make safety features for these if you are worried about it. They make a low level sensor that will flash a warning light. They make a flow light that tells you its flowing and they even make a waste-gate adaptor to dump boost if you loose flow.

With a mild tune the trionic will dump boost. Jak was in my car driving it at 30psi with w/m on, pull after pull, we ran out of w/m, bam car went from 28psi to 20psi and the power just fell off. It was obvious what had happened. We pulled over and sure enough, out of w/m in the bottle.

I just keep it safe and check it every couple of days and keep it topped off. I carry around a mixed bottle in my trunk and have not run out in 2 years now.

With aggressive timing, big gains can be had with w/m injection and I even run the 50hp shot of nitromethane when racing. If you had it tuned that way, you would want to keep an eye on things, you will notice if it runs out, the boost drops, the power drops off and somethimes it will even throw a check engine light for the 02 sensor because the mixture changes so much.

Good luck,

John
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Old 01-17-2008, 05:44 PM   #18
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They make safety features for these if you are worried about it. They make a low level sensor that will flash a warning light. They make a flow light that tells you its flowing and they even make a waste-gate adaptor to dump boost if you loose flow.

With a mild tune the trionic will dump boost. Jak was in my car driving it at 30psi with w/m on, pull after pull, we ran out of w/m, bam car went from 28psi to 20psi and the power just fell off. It was obvious what had happened. We pulled over and sure enough, out of w/m in the bottle.

I just keep it safe and check it every couple of days and keep it topped off. I carry around a mixed bottle in my trunk and have not run out in 2 years now.

With aggressive timing, big gains can be had with w/m injection and I even run the 50hp shot of nitromethane when racing. If you had it tuned that way, you would want to keep an eye on things, you will notice if it runs out, the boost drops, the power drops off and somethimes it will even throw a check engine light for the 02 sensor because the mixture changes so much.

Good luck,

John
i wanted to wire in the flow switch to sound a buzzer and a light, i want the float switch to just turn on the light.

John, what do you have for safty in you car? how well does it work?
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Old 01-18-2008, 07:26 AM   #19
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I just use my wide-band to watch my a/f ratio, the w/m will richen the mixture from .5 to 1.0 and I know where my car runs.

Like I said, you will feel the power difference if something is wrong and it stops working, when you loose 40wtrq and 30whp, you feel it!

I just check my bottle every day or every other day, keep it topped off and watch my wide-band and make sure my car feels the same when I do a pull.

I don't run any other safety pieces on my set-up...

The one ecu I like is the one Jak set up with some advanced timing, it friggin screams and I gained about 4 tenths on the 1/4 mile drag strip.

A chemical IC is awesome because it does not require air flow to work! Adds some safety to an aggressive tune and you can also add the nitromethane power booster and have a 50hp shot!

Today my car was friggin screaming, I hit third gear and lit the tires up
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Old 01-18-2008, 09:51 AM   #20
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Today my car was friggin screaming, I hit third gear and lit the tires up
That's when racing becomes a little difficult. But I suspect you'll go back to drag radials this summer or even slicks
So about how much do you spend a week/month to top off your tank? I never even thought about the cost of putting that in all the time...
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