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Performance Modifications for the NG900 / Old 9-3 This forum contains PERFORMANCE related Q&A's for the NG900 and 9-3. This may also include suspension.

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Old 09-30-2007, 05:10 PM   #1
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toluene

I've run a few tanks of gas with a mixture of toluene. Most recently I've added 3 gals. With the cooler temperature and the added octane the toluene provides a very nice increase in power. Normally it's pretty expensive stuff, but I get a major discount at my job so it becomes more viable. Xylene is also an option but the toulene runs cooler I believe and is the better choice.

I happened to run into a gentleman who is a big porsche guy. He was telling me about his 560+ whp 944 turbo. He saw me getting the toluene and conversation led to him meantioning how he also runs it in his porsche and after about 40% he said it started to foul the plugs.

Interesting thing... I removed my catylic converter awhile back (have a CEL) but when I run techron (fuel system cleaner) or toluene which is also an industrial cleaner my CEL goes off for ~100 miles. Curious.
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Old 09-30-2007, 05:15 PM   #2
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Mmmm...toluene is good stuff...especially when you bond it with three nitrogens!

Regardless...I've been curious to play with some of that stuff too as 100 octane is hard to obtain here in VT, and toluene would make for some fun chemistry and is super boost friendly.
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Old 09-30-2007, 05:18 PM   #3
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Where can you get this and what does it normally cost? I wouldnt mind trying it sometime!
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Old 09-30-2007, 05:20 PM   #4
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Well some Nitromethane would be pretty sweet but its usually $30/gal. Plus I don't know how well our cars would accept it.
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Old 09-30-2007, 05:25 PM   #5
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Ryan to answer your question, I work at a paint store. I think our list is like $14-$15 a gallon (I get it for half of that ). Im sure theres other places to get it though since it's an industrial cleaner. they do offer it in 5 gallon buckets which would be a tad cheaper as well.

5 gallons is the most I'd prolly put in my 17 gallon tank. You could always buy it in bulk and just keep it around for when you fill up. Be carefull though, the vapors have a flash point of ~100 degrees F.
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Old 09-30-2007, 05:27 PM   #6
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Hmmm...Im going to have to browse our inventory system at work - we might need to order some!
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Old 09-30-2007, 05:33 PM   #7
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Xylene or Benzene will work also, but for the price the toluene is better and benzene is highly carcinogenic. some other aromatic compounds, even constituents of benzene are NOT cancer causing so there may be some other cheaper options out there. I still need to look around for the best price/safe/power producing agent.
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Old 09-30-2007, 05:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Makeyousaab View Post
Xylene or Benzene will work also, but for the price the toluene is better and benzene is highly carcinogenic. some other aromatic compounds, even constituents of benzene are NOT cancer causing so there may be some other cheaper options out there. I still need to look around for the best price/safe/power producing agent.
Maybe two or so years ago there were a lot of threads on the whole toluene/xylene subject on one of the Saabnet boards.

The best power producing agent? Get your car tuned
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Old 09-30-2007, 05:40 PM   #9
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Yes Mike - but what would my car + touline = ....

Edit - that was a stupid question, it will probably = me breaking more shit.
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Old 09-30-2007, 06:37 PM   #10
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Its a good idea to use some marvel mystery oil, about 3 ounces to wet the mix down.
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Old 09-30-2007, 06:47 PM   #11
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I ran 1 gallon of toluene on 6gallons of gas, and the power seemed to be better, but I blew a tire and my clutch was slipping so I can't give great feedback on it.
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Old 10-01-2007, 03:55 AM   #12
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Also run the stuff; Many people were weary neary about it.

Nice power delivery on warmer days; I think it's not so much giving you power, as making it retain: warmer days were feeling like cooler nights, instead.

I think I paid $11-$12 at the paint store using my account.

He slings paint; I apply paint. He still gets the better price.

*sigh*.

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Old 10-01-2007, 05:28 AM   #13
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You can get research grade (99.7% pure) toluene from a number of online chemical suppliers...pricey tho...$27 per liter. Paint thinner is probably cheaper and acceptable.

Benzene is nasty, nasty stuff.

Three nitrogens makes it trinitrotoluene, or TNT (nitromethane only has one nitro IIRC).

Enough nerd chemistry...

Toluene will improve your safety margin on hot days or poor conditions for higher boost....so a tuned car (with healthy A/F) will be even safer with some toluene in the fuel. It will definitely reduce the effects of heat soak...
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Old 10-01-2007, 05:35 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Makeyousaab View Post
Be carefull though, the vapors have a flash point of ~100 degrees F.
F that make sure it isn't a warm day when you poor it.
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Old 10-01-2007, 11:32 AM   #15
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Here is a good source on using it and why its good...

Toulene - Octane Booster FAQ

Worth the read, some very interesting facts in there.]

Such as
Quote:
Q: How did you discover using toluene?

A: Someone came across a web page that described various DIY home brew octane booster formulas. One of which used toluene as its main ingredient. As a Formula 1 racing fan of many years, I recalled that toluene was used extensively in the turbo era in the 1980s by all the Formula 1 teams. The 1.5 liter turbocharged engines ran as much as 5 bars of boost (73 psi) in qualifying and 4 bars (59 psi) in the actual race. Power output exceeded 1500bhp, which translates into 1000bhp/liter, an astronomical figure.
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Old 10-01-2007, 11:48 AM   #16
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Well some Nitromethane would be pretty sweet but its usually $30/gal. Plus I don't know how well our cars would accept it.

We tried using some nitro in a old race car many years ago!! It made the coolest red fire ball under the car when the pistons hit the ground on the back staight. I think we might not have mixed it right
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Old 10-01-2007, 12:12 PM   #17
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If Im reading his right you guys use paint thinner to make your cars faster?
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Old 10-01-2007, 12:15 PM   #18
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If Im reading his right you guys use paint thinner to make your cars faster?
I've never used paint thinnner/ wouldn't use paint thinner, but toluene is a sure thing, its a byproduct of oil refining and is a major octane booster in the gasoline we buy at the pumps.

I don't believe, however, it would help with NA cars.
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Old 10-01-2007, 12:18 PM   #19
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^^^ It should work with N/A, just shows more benefit with the higher compression of forced induction.
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Old 10-01-2007, 12:33 PM   #20
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I've never used paint thinnner/ wouldn't use paint thinner, but toluene is a sure thing, its a byproduct of oil refining and is a major octane booster in the gasoline we buy at the pumps.

I don't believe, however, it would help with NA cars.
Actually, you can use paint thinner...just make sure you get the right one.

http://paint-and-supplies.hardwarest...nt-143487.aspx

Courtesy of your local Aubuchon...I picked some of this up at Shelburne Hardware earlier today....
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