|08-27-2007 09:31 PM|
Look at it this way, the higher CR of your car will cut down on your spool time, and PSI for PSI you will always be making more power on boost or off than a factory turbo saab with the same boost. The higher CR means you have to be much more careful making your ignition maps, but 10-14 psi is totally doable on pump gas with a good standalone EFI controller. Just look for a haltech E6x or E8 on the bay and you'll have more than enough computing power for your goals. If you were to base your car around the 15t, you could have a setup that makes as much power as an aero but spools instantly like a LPT car would.
The key is getting a beater first so you can work out all of the kinks with the saab. I do like the C900 exhaust manifold idea though, you might have to relocate some stuff under the hood but that would look really cool and sound even better.
|08-27-2007 02:24 PM|
|08-27-2007 06:12 AM|
There's no sense in trying to turbo an N/A - for what it would cost to do it right, you could get another Saab with a blown up engine and rebuild it. If you have the mechanical aptitude to try to turbo one of these cars yourself, surely you could just re-build an engine. It'd probably be much more straight forward. This has been discussed time and time again. If you like the car, just keep it and get something else on the side. I was in the same boat, it was talked about, and finally I just got something else.
It's more work than it's worth.
|08-27-2007 05:56 AM|
i thought i might have figured out a way to do it one time. get all the bits like the manifold and turbo and slap it on. then put on one of the best saab developments made in the 80's APC. thats how we got away running moonracers 2.1 SPG w/~15 psi. that would give you boost protection for ping. as far as the bottom end it's a shot in the dark but i do know mike connely was telling me about his 270 hp N/A NG900 he built so you'd think they should handle 7-8 psi you'd think.
the other thing i read somewhere was that motronic had a ~400g/s limit that was used as a fuel cut. dont know if it was true or not and it was for another version (2.8.6 i think) instead of what we run. so an aftermarket EM would be needed or a motronic burner.
|08-23-2007 06:25 PM|
i never realized that part... i figured it was easy as pie to turbo a skivic and cheap too. didnt ever think that there were many sitting in garages disassembled with owners rubbing their heads... makes lots of sense though.
|08-23-2007 04:16 AM|
Haha, thats funny about the jap cars... and so true, a buddy of mine was working on his prelude for 8 months, all the while driving his mom's car. i guess he finished it, but now its for sale... so what does that tell you.
I guess in the end I was just wondering if it had been done before, or how hard it would be... seems to me that it wont be happening anytime soon ( for me at least ) . I'll keep my eyes out for a wrecked turbo out there though... that way it'll be ready once i am.
|08-22-2007 03:23 PM|
|PAsaab900||tweek u posted to the wrong thread im the one with the stang...... see my stang isnt an every day driver..... n the saab isnt fast enough.....lol......so thats y i want to go forced induction.... i might just do this setup n if i blow the motor then ow well... i have a bike to drive.....lol....|
|08-22-2007 12:37 PM|
|08-22-2007 12:28 PM|
I do agree that there are lots of failures that you dont hear about but the fact remains there are LPT turbo kits for cars with B16A's in them that are sold by normal vendors (Greddy, Jackson Racing etc.. ) and that simplifies things for those people who run motors like that. With a B16A with dished 8.5Cr pistons from JE you can have a very nice 400HP daily driver. Its just all about time and money and thats it.
Aftermarket support is the largest limiting factor to the SAAB market and always will be. If you can get a good piston setup and find an aftermarket (MS, or other) engine management setup then I say go for it as long as you have another beater to use in the interim.
|08-22-2007 12:14 PM|
totally agree with tweek here. i'm not trying to discourage you, but here's my best advice: try and find a wrecked 900turbo. you can then swap the engine, all the wiring w/t5, gauge cluster....everything. saabs factory shit is all very very good. that's one of the reasons you don't see people going aftermarket for everything like on these "jap cars".
also, don't think that all the asian cars are so easy to boost. you only see the ones out on the street that were a success. there's plenty of them stuck in garages with extra block ventelation, if ya know what i mean.
you should call up nick T. they have an n/a ng900 shop car that they did a bunch of stuff to with some success. apparantly there is some potential from that motor without forced induction.
lastly, do not, do not, don't, DO NOT take on this kind of project if this is your only means of transportation and you can't afford the down time. sometimes the best investment to make a project like this come out right is a beater. the end result will always be better when you don't have to rush things.
|08-22-2007 10:44 AM|
First off, take a look at your mustang, now look at how fast it is/ compared to the money you spent on it.
Now look at the na saab. Think about the money that will be involved in making it slower and more expensive than a regular turbo saab. Do you want to be in so deep, as with the mustang?
Yes the Na 2.3 and viggen have the same displacement, but the viggen is made for the rigors of turbocharged life, the 2.3 na wasn't. Thats why we put 2.3 9000 aero engines in our cars, not 2.3 na engines.
|08-22-2007 10:39 AM|
|JK||I've heard of people running 12+ psi on b212 motors in classic 900s. Not sure of the compression ratio, but it's up there too.|
|08-22-2007 10:26 AM|
You know if it the compression ratio was under 10:1 (say anything around 9:5:1) I would say to go for it in stock form with and use an SDS controller to add fuel to the motor when under boost.
I just think that with an almost 10:5 compression ratio you will end up grenading at some point and time. But man keep in mind.... dont be afraid to dream!! Thats how this country was built!
|08-22-2007 10:21 AM|
oh... my car is pushing it for sure. i shouldnt even be thinking about this stuff with 150,000 miles
curiosity killed the cat right?
|08-22-2007 10:19 AM|
think i could find some ricer out there running the same compression and run a similar turbo set up? probably not, eh? theres just too much coming into play with boost now a days ...
just seems so easy for all those damn japan cars to slap a turbo on... ta da!
its not fair!
|08-22-2007 10:17 AM|
All I would say on a higher mileage car and using the bottle would be to do a HG on it and make sure that there is no blow by going on with a leak down test on the cylinders.
AS for a spare car keep an eye out for a low cost C900 of 9000 and use that as a daily while you build a turbo 2.3(used to be n/a) sleeper!!!
|08-22-2007 10:15 AM|
|Drew in Houston||
The other issue is how many miles are on your current engine? If the car's a '94 with a bunch of miles it may soon be time to consider a rebuild/upgrade anyway?
I don't think you'd want to put a real high miles daily driver on the bottle, or add a turbo for that matter.
Although... a high compression turbo engine with full time water/meth injection might be doable, and would be very cool too.
|08-22-2007 10:14 AM|
90 mm bore, 90 mm stroke, 10.5 compression ratio on the B234i
Where I think the B205R has a 90MM Bore but a 78MM stroke if I remember correctly.
|08-22-2007 10:10 AM|
For the occassional use you can put your car on the "bottle" with a 50 Shot setup that will run with no real issues.
But if you are going to go forced induction then I really have to say lower the compression ratio first and then look at boost.
Now you could talk to JE Pistons or one of the other manufacturers and tell them what you want to do and they should be able to build a piston for you (on special order) that would accomidate some of the compression ratio issues.
Or do the always mentioned..... 2.0 Crank, Piston and Rod swap which essentially give you a 2.0 motor (in rough translation) with a little extra bore.
|08-22-2007 10:08 AM|
|Drew in Houston||
If it were me and I didn't want to change cars, I'd run the one that I had till it dies and in the meantime keep a lookout for a wrecked B205/235R that got hit in the rear, and buy that car outright for the engine swap and all the supporting pieces, harness, turbo, etc...
The other issue is how many miles are on the existing engine? You probably wouldn't want to just bolt a turbo onto a tired high miles engine anyway.
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