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N/A Performance Modifications for the NG900 / Old 9-3 This forum contains PERFORMANCE related Q&A's specific to NATURALLY ASPIRATED NG900 and old 9-3.

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Old 06-19-2008, 04:11 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perkj View Post
Hey Nick...

Any reason why you didn't just go with a simple Bosch CIS (or CIS-E) injection setup? These are a dime a dozen at any wrecking yard off any pre-90 VW. CIS requires no remapping and can handle quite a bit of HP....before we moved to dual-webers on our Drag Rabbit, we used a CIS-Basic system and put down 13.1 (Normally Asperated of course and on an 8V motor). CIS is simple and makes the car very peppy.....one of the best FI systems for Normal Asperation IMO.
CIS is a glorified carb, and never came on ng900's, just for starters.

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Old 06-19-2008, 05:13 PM   #22
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CIS is a glorified carb, and never came on ng900's, just for starters.

Paul
I understand that, but a CIS system can be put on any car within a few hours....I've seen autocrossers put it Fords, Hondas, Toyotas, etc etc. My point was it must have been more trouble retrofitting a T5 system than it would be to put a CIS system on.

BTW, CIS isn't a glorified by any means....far from it....its a mechnical FI meaning its metered system unlike carbs. Carbs require jet changes and sinking to obtain a/f needs.
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Old 11-24-2008, 04:15 PM   #23
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has this car been dynoed yet? It sounds pretty cool. id like more details
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Old 11-24-2008, 04:21 PM   #24
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I understand that, but a CIS system can be put on any car within a few hours....I've seen autocrossers put it Fords, Hondas, Toyotas, etc etc. My point was it must have been more trouble retrofitting a T5 system than it would be to put a CIS system on.

BTW, CIS isn't a glorified by any means....far from it....its a mechnical FI meaning its metered system unlike carbs. Carbs require jet changes and sinking to obtain a/f needs.

Installing shitty CIS onto a car not originally equipped with it is downright kooky.
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Old 11-24-2008, 04:29 PM   #25
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My point was it must have been more trouble retrofitting a T5 system than it would be to put a CIS system on.
Oh, yeah, I don't think so

The harness is pretty damn easy to swap out Pretty much unplug, then plug and play.


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Installing shitty CIS onto a car not originally equipped with it is downright kooky.
Yeah, no doubt!
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Old 11-24-2008, 04:49 PM   #26
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CIS is fucking terrible. you can keep it perkj
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Old 11-24-2008, 09:01 PM   #27
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has this car been dynoed yet? It sounds pretty cool. id like more details
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Not a high priority project.
Besides, I think it's broke

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Old 11-25-2008, 06:34 AM   #28
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CIS would not have solved the ignition mapping problem..

There are lots of dyno runs.. If anybody wants the dyno run files just email me. I can zip and send them all. Not time to gif each one.

Trans was certainly run dry after the seal went. Took 45min to get it out last night and another 15min of hammering to get the driveshafts out.. Little welded into the diff.
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2.0 GOOSE 500whp + 8500rpm = 11.06 @125 E85
Viggen 439whp / 447tq 12.43 @114 on Gt2871.64, (Now 511whp Gt3076)
Nordic E85 9-3 SS Aero 320hp / 350ftlbs
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Old 11-28-2008, 05:09 PM   #29
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Besides, I think it's broke
Nope all back together with the best junk "t" transmssion and used viggen clutch we had.

2 hours to swap the trans and another hour to put the subframe bolts back in.. Its a little bit the wrong shape and most of them were stripped out the last time.
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2.0 GOOSE 500whp + 8500rpm = 11.06 @125 E85
Viggen 439whp / 447tq 12.43 @114 on Gt2871.64, (Now 511whp Gt3076)
Nordic E85 9-3 SS Aero 320hp / 350ftlbs
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Old 07-20-2009, 11:33 AM   #30
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Any updates with this beast?
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Old 07-21-2009, 06:15 AM   #31
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No time to mess with it. Just parked in the back.
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2.0 GOOSE 500whp + 8500rpm = 11.06 @125 E85
Viggen 439whp / 447tq 12.43 @114 on Gt2871.64, (Now 511whp Gt3076)
Nordic E85 9-3 SS Aero 320hp / 350ftlbs
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Old 07-21-2009, 07:15 AM   #32
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Old 07-21-2009, 04:45 PM   #33
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at SOC02 was a 95 ish give or take NG, all motor, 280hp with dyno sheet posted on window, sounded like a motorcycle when he revved it, never seen something go from idle to redline that fast....wish I new more, I love built normally aspirated motors...
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Old 07-22-2009, 07:29 AM   #34
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at SOC02 was a 95 ish give or take NG, all motor, 280hp with dyno sheet posted on window, sounded like a motorcycle when he revved it, never seen something go from idle to redline that fast....wish I new more, I love built normally aspirated motors...

A very happy dyno I suppose. The problem is that you an expect about 100hp/ L on the wheels with a very highly prepped engine with great VE> I can tell you that the ports in our saabs are optimized for boost. Not NA at all. You simply cannot get the air that dense to fit enough to make 280hp through our tiny ports. Even enlarged all the way to the outside of the casting it would be pretty difficult. Now the second option would be since we are limited in torque from the cylinder pressure to extend it higher in the rpm range to see more putts per cycle and therefore more Horsepower. But again we are limited by port flow this time by piston velocity at high revs. Then there is getting the gasses out of the head that was through a stock header which is quite small for "280hp" Same goes for the inlet manifold. I had decent gains going to the less restrictive (larger ports) turbo manifold it also had the benefit of shorter runners to help the high rpm filling. Basically thats a fib unless there was a fair bit of nitrous. 280hp sounds about right for a 100shot
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2.0 GOOSE 500whp + 8500rpm = 11.06 @125 E85
Viggen 439whp / 447tq 12.43 @114 on Gt2871.64, (Now 511whp Gt3076)
Nordic E85 9-3 SS Aero 320hp / 350ftlbs
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Old 07-22-2009, 07:37 AM   #35
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Point taken but i talked to the guy at length about it, and he seemed honest and candid about some of the problems he had building it...Older gentleman, been building motors since the 60's, i seem to recall something like a 8000rpm redline...man i wish i could recall the details...anyone out there remember this car? It was sitting next to my silver airflow c900 at the kings island 2002 SOC...

Perry
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Old 07-22-2009, 09:20 AM   #36
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This guy?
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Old 07-22-2009, 09:36 AM   #37
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Yep stock header, stock intake, still has MAF in the way so no fuel tuning and pretty decent VE restriction at high rpm., ignition timing still dictated by maps in motronic.

You can rescale maf and injectors fuel pressure for fueling but then you skew the timing all over since the load input is way wrong for best timing.

I have many many hours on the dyno fully instrumented. I am even running the t7 head with higher flowing ports and smaller stems to help ve. Oh and then there is still that stock exhaust manifold. Cross section is on the small side since factory target was pretty low.
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2.0 GOOSE 500whp + 8500rpm = 11.06 @125 E85
Viggen 439whp / 447tq 12.43 @114 on Gt2871.64, (Now 511whp Gt3076)
Nordic E85 9-3 SS Aero 320hp / 350ftlbs
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Old 07-22-2009, 09:37 AM   #38
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well....that is a (was) a beautiful car, but my memory is the pits ill admit and I honestly dont recall...sad to see what happened to that car tho...wow...anyone have any stats on Connely's car, is it the one i was thinking of? Oh, maybe I can dig up the old pics of my car at the 02 Soc and see if he was the second car down on the passenger side.
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Old 08-04-2009, 11:30 PM   #39
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how is that project going on this N/A motor any work worthy numbers popping up because I'd be willing to try this on my 9000
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Old 08-06-2009, 02:00 PM   #40
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i want to do this regardless of gains
i just want better fuel maps now that my N/A is boosted
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