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Old 05-22-2012, 10:16 AM   #1
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Viggen's Mysterious Engine Whine... Video inside

So while I was in Carlisle, my engine started to make a tight whining noise...

What causes it... Only does it when revving, not affected by steering. Whines when it's cold AND warm... temperature doesn't change it.

Water pump has less than 20k miles on it, brand new OEM timing chain, balance shaft chain, guides, sprockets, bs chain tensioner, 6 puck clutch, oem slave, tensioner pulley, idler pulley, etc... No sludge in the pan, clean screen and crankcase.

Other notes, the shop that installed the tensioner didn't tighten the plunger bolt to the chain tensioner body and it wasn't even finger tight. I ended up removing the tensioner and reset the leg and reinstalled. The whine went away for a day, and now it has returned. Is it possible that the timing chain tensioner is bad? I have never seen one fail and not sure what the symptoms would be when they do.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.


I haven't had the chance to pull my belt to see if it goes away yet.
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Old 05-22-2012, 10:33 AM   #2
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That is not chain noise. Parts fail that are nearly new. Not likely, but they do.
Do you have your AC on? Some people with ACC actually have the AC on all the time; those compressors are kinda noisy sometimes. I'd pull the belt off and move from there.
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Old 05-22-2012, 10:39 AM   #3
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A/C is deleted...
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Old 05-22-2012, 11:44 AM   #4
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that sounds very much like a partially clogged sump or possibly a stuck oil filter check valve. put your hand on the oil filter while someone revs it and see if it's vibrating like crazy. if it is, then it's a fortunate lucky fix. (oe filters do this from time to time) if it's not coming from there, it sounds like you might need to drop the pan. i'm sure this isn't what you want to hear right now....if it's not coming from the filter, i'd be willing to be the shop used either the wrong sealant on the timing cover, or way too much of it and that's what's making your oil pickup scream.
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Old 05-22-2012, 12:29 PM   #5
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So I just noticed that the shop used RTV sealant all along the perimeter of the brand new OEM valve cover gaskets; NOT HAPPY. It's oozing out all around the valve cover and the head. If it oozed out on the outside, it surely oozed out on the inside. I am worried that a piece of the sealant may have reached it's way into an oil passage or into the oil pickup screen. Also checked the belt, and it's not rubbing against anything...

Keep in mind, I just had the following replaced last week...

Oem Timing/balance shaft chain kit (sprockets, guides, balance shaft tensioner, o-rings, etc), front main seal, rear main seal, shift rod seal, axle seals, oem clutch slave cylinder, 6 puck Clutchnet clutch disc, new viggen pressure plate, poly engine mount, poly tranny mount, resurfaced flywheel...

Now I am coming up with this whine and a loud rattling noise from the clutch when it is released. Also noticed that there appears to be a bit of a gap between the transmission and the engine block behind the downpipe.

I emailed the shop with all of my concerns and expressed how disappointed I am and that I expect them to address all of the issues and fix it right this time.

This is why I like to do all of my work myself! I have done everything from motors, tranny's, head gaskets, turbos, etc. in all of my Saabs since I was 15 years old... I was tired of doing it all in my driveway without a garage so I figured I'd spend the money and have this stuff done for me. Now look what happens.

Here's the clutch noise...



And Ethan, I too was thinking it sounded like an oil supply problem... doesn't sound like a pulley, it sounds internal.
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Old 05-22-2012, 12:44 PM   #6
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told you to be careful who you let touch your car and especially your engine
I bet they hadn't done a job like that in years..


its deff some sort of pulley whine...
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Old 05-22-2012, 01:02 PM   #7
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You also told me I would never sell my wheels, yet I had 5 people at Carlisle wanting them and I sold them for my original asking price within an hour of being there without any hesitation from the buyer or haggling. He also gave me a set of aero Thule racks with fairing for a 3 door 9-3 on top of the $500.

I was also informed of bad things about Steve and was told he screwed up several Saabs at Blakes in his time there. To each his own, it's a risk no matter where you take your vehicle.

The car will be fixed one way or another, and it's not coming out of my pocket. They will be digging back into it once I get the chance to bring it back down there. If they can't get it right the 2nd time, then legal action will follow until I am reimbursed for any damage that has been caused and for the money spent on labor so I can bring it elsewhere.
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Old 05-22-2012, 01:13 PM   #8
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I was also informed of bad things about Steve and was told he screwed up several Saabs at Blakes in his time there. To each his own, it's a risk no matter where you take your vehicle.
I hope you're not referring to my main man Steve Snow, he is the freaking shit!!! I definitely can't stand by and let anyone bad mouth him...

Good luck fixing your problem though Zach, whatever it is. If it's something the shop did hopefully they stand behind their work. My 9-5 has had a whine when cold for a lil while now, higher pitched than yours, just haven't had a chance to check it out. Will be curious to hear what your issue is, and this encourages me to get mine over and checked out sooner than later (by Steve of course )
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Old 05-22-2012, 01:54 PM   #9
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Yes, Steve Snow... just going by what my dad told me (general manager of the dealership Steve worked at prior to becoming an indy and saw first hand Steve's screw ups and pissed off customers). Everyone makes mistakes, and nobody's perfect...

Quote:
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its deff some sort of pulley whine...
As for the whining, it's definitely oil pressure or input shaft bearing related. I just pulled the serpentine belt and the whine remained. On a positive note, my pumps and pulleys are dead silent as I heard little to no difference with the belt on or removed.

And yes, they stand behind their work and said they'd take it in no problem and give me a loaner car again... I just hope they can get it right this time. They'll have to spend time cleaning everything and making sure there isn't any crap in the oil passages/pan/screen... There was no noise when I brought it in, so something happened while it was in the shop (leading to believe it was the RTV they used on the valve cover gaskets)... They've met their worst nightmare of a customer. I'm the person who will turn his radio off several times while driving to listen for any abnormal noises...
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Old 05-22-2012, 02:13 PM   #10
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Also, my cousin is one of the most knowledgeable Saab techs I know (best friends with John Moss and helped write a lot of the stuff in WIS for 9-3SS's and has an indy garage now) who would have definitely done it right the first time and likely charges similar rates as Steve, but I couldn't afford to pay double the amount for labor. Money is tight and I really didn't have the option to bring it to my cousin. It sucks, but such is life.
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Old 05-23-2012, 02:23 AM   #11
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sounds more Trans related..... But The timing chain tensioner shouldn't have had any effect on the noise in that case.

We've also had some funky noises from balance shafts and main bearings in the last week or so. I think I need to start a career in Beer brewing..... Much less messy and the rewards are greater!
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Old 05-23-2012, 02:49 AM   #12
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I think I need to start a career in Beer brewing..... Much less messy and the rewards are greater!
I like! If you need anyone to guinea pig anything let me know!!! I've come across lots of beers I didn't like, but very few I wouldn't drink
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Old 05-23-2012, 06:04 AM   #13
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Zach, I definitely sympathize for you here! Those noises + unknown cause(s) + significant outlay of money + hopes of quality job + car that you love = major stress.

Hopefully, this tech/shop will get the car reliable and back on the road for you asap! Otherwise, you should do whatever is in your power to make them pay for the damage to your car and the time you'll be without it.
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Old 05-23-2012, 08:47 AM   #14
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This is why I like to do all of my work myself! I have done everything from motors, tranny's, head gaskets, turbos, etc. in all of my Saabs since I was 15 years old... I was tired of doing it all in my driveway without a garage so I figured I'd spend the money and have this stuff done for me. Now look what happens.
If you've been doing this stuff for that long you ought to know how ineffective it is to post a video on the internet and expect your car to get diagnosed by us lovely folks!
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Old 05-23-2012, 01:51 PM   #15
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Quote:
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If you've been doing this stuff for that long you ought to know how ineffective it is to post a video on the internet and expect your car to get diagnosed by us lovely folks!
It never hurts to get another person's opinion... This whine was a new one for me, haven't heard one like it... As well as the clutch noise with it let out.

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Zach, I definitely sympathize for you here! Those noises + unknown cause(s) + significant outlay of money + hopes of quality job + car that you love = major stress.

Hopefully, this tech/shop will get the car reliable and back on the road for you asap! Otherwise, you should do whatever is in your power to make them pay for the damage to your car and the time you'll be without it.
Thanks man... yeah, it's beyond stressful at this point. I'm furious. They give me a loaner car, but it's the principle. I now have to buy more oil, a filter, and tranny fluid; which I will be making sure they reimburse me for. The car goes back to the shop tomorrow morning. I just hope I'm not going to be chasing my tail with this shop for the next few months with similar results everytime. I am leading to believe that the balance shafts were not timed correctly.

The timing chain tensioner was just a coincidence that it seemed to take the noise away for a bit... not sure why that happened. It didn't make sense to me either why that would have any affect on the noise. I just hope that whatever is making the clutch noise hasn't damaged anything in the process. I'm thinking they may have forgotten to put loctite on the flywheel bolts and one or 2 of them has backed out a bit. Either that or they didn't line the tranny up properly on the input shaft.
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:09 PM   #16
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Did you put your hand on the oil filter like I mentioned?
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:20 PM   #17
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Oof. That rattling sounds bad.
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:40 PM   #18
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Did you put your hand on the oil filter like I mentioned?
I haven't...
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Old 05-24-2012, 11:24 AM   #19
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Well the car is back in the shop... just got a call saying it was the timing chain tensioner. They replaced it with a new one and drove it around and it seems to be gone. Hopefully it stays that way.

I just did a google for timing chain tensioner whine and I found a few videos that sound exactly like my car did... zero noise at idle, but whine as soon as you rev it up. I guess it's a really common problem with Nissan's.

Looks like Timing Chain Tensioners: RPM related Whine - VIDS - SUPERNISSANS.NET Nissan Owners Community




The next step is to take the transmission out to find what's making that rattling noise.

I will be sure to drive the car for a good bit while I'm down there to save myself an extra trip (100 miles each way to the shop from my house) in case it returns. It does make sense though seeing as how when I reset the tensioner and reinstalled it, the whine went away for about 30 miles, and then returned.
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Old 05-24-2012, 11:35 AM   #20
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Almost every T7 car I have heard has a a bit of a whine to it, some louder than the others. My Viggen has a little whine, but the motor has 20k on it and everything was replaced!
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